JB

Jacklyn Buhrmann

Things Jacklyn Says on Podcasts

Where to Find Them

Jacklyn Buhrmann has been a guest on The Space Policy Show .

Recently: “Ep. 179: Space Economy Under the Microscope” on The Space Policy Show (November 2026).

What They Said

“All the estimates of the size of the space economy and the growth forecasts that we're seeing vary pretty wildly, because there's no one definition of the space economy. The BEA's definition is very expansive: everything that takes place in space, everything that supports it, and all the things that depend on space to function. But to understand the production of satellites, you need a much narrower definition.” — Jacklyn Buhrmann, The Space Policy Show

Asked whether the space economy would include Uber rides and Amazon deliveries, Jacklyn Buhrmann explains why published figures can't be compared. The Bureau of Economic Analysis counts anything that depends on space, while industry analysis needs a narrower scope.

The Space Policy Show · 2026-11-12 Permalink → Listen →
The Space Policy Show Around 06:32 into the episode
Andrew Berglund

…missions. So I think the why is really an important point to start with there. And then EMAC and Jackie have done some really great work digging through the different ways that we think through how those estimates are made and how we figure out those projections, because it's not a simple exercise.

Colleen Stover

Yeah, I've recently, you know, people often ask the question, are we really going to be measuring the space economy through like the number of Uber rides and Amazon deliveries? Jackie?

Jacklyn Buhrmann

So, yeah, that's a good question. How expansive do we want this definition of the space economy to be? There was a good analysis of this done by the Bureau of Economic Analysis, the BEA, a few years ago, where they went through this exercise to measure the space economy and their definition. The space economy was really expansive. I'm not sure if it would have included Uber and Amazon, but they tried to include everything that takes place in space, everything that supports the things that take place in space, and all the things that depend on space to function. And so, you might think of things like Uber and Amazon as using either communications from space or using GPS. As part of that, I don't know if that fell in the BEA's definition. But, yeah, that's a very expansive definition of the space economy, and it made a lot of sense for the BEA to be looking at it that way. So, the BEA's definition is very expansive because their goal was really to just measure the whole value of economic activity that takes place in or depends on space. But for other activities like trying to understand the space industry and the production of satellites and things like that, you need a much narrower definition.…

Colleen Stover

Oh, I love it. The economist has an unclear answer. It's not clear.

Jacklyn Buhrmann

It depends.

Colleen Stover

It depends. So, yeah, so you kind of started talking a little bit about like in terms of production, right? And I know that there's different ways, you know, what we've traditionally called kind of upstream things before something is, you know, the making of something, I suppose. And then there's…

Speaker names come from our own diarization. The position is estimated from where the line sits in the episode.
“Can two supply chains scale at the same time if they rely on some of the same upstream suppliers? You might look at the supply chain for one kind of satellite and conclude it can scale, then look at another and conclude that too. But the same small supplier might enter both. That is so hard to know from the data that we have. Frankly, it's probably unknowable from the data that we have.” — Jacklyn Buhrmann, The Space Policy Show

Asked what decision-makers should watch for, Jacklyn Buhrmann describes a hidden risk: analysing supply chains one product at a time can miss a small supplier that several programmes share. She says the available economic data cannot show it.

The Space Policy Show · 2026-11-12 Permalink → Listen →
The Space Policy Show Around 43:17 into the episode
Andrew Berglund

…that sort of really critical work forward that's spread all over the country, right? Like, these are state-level programs and national-level programs can both be really directed here in an important way to make sure that there is nearby capacity and capability to sustain the space industrial base.

Colleen Stover

…up new workforce, but at the state level to take over these mom and pop garage garage places and keep the supply chain resilient. Yeah, Jackie, what do you think about what is something that you think decision makers need to be kind of looking out for? How can we better inform the future for them?

Jacklyn Buhrmann

So, I think one thing that comes to mind for me when we're thinking about policy tools is using the policies that you already have access to carefully. There are things like the DPAS, the defense priorities and allocation system, is that right? Where suppliers can get ratings through DPAS to get preferential access to raw materials and to other inputs that they need. And so, I think one of the things that can be done is really carefully using that tool that's in place to make sure that the priorities that are set there reflect the more holistic priorities that we have. Because that's one tool that we have to ensure that the things that really matter to the government actually get that prioritization and get access to. The materials and the inputs that they need. But you asked what the thing is to look out for. I think for me, I'm with Andrew on look at those mom and pop machine shops and other sort of small but important parts of the supply chain. I think the biggest unknown here is maybe where there are small suppliers that enter into upstream in different kinds of supply chains, right? So you might have a look at the supply chain for one kind of satellite or one kind…

Colleen Stover

Andrew, any last words? We're almost at time here, so I wanted to offer you something.

Andrew Berglund

Yeah, I guess I would just say I think the industry needs consistency. And I think, again, kind of going back to some of the acquisition transformation work, we're in a period where I think there's more bipartisan consensus that stronger interventions are needed. And we just need to see that work…

Colleen Stover

Love it. That's great. Well, thank you both very much for joining today. This was kind of a primer, really, like looking across that whole kind of space economy. What is it? What is it not? Where are the vulnerabilities? And I really appreciate you guys being here.

Speaker names come from our own diarization. The position is estimated from where the line sits in the episode.

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