“All of those clean technologies, the technical answer to climate change, have advanced way beyond anything that anyone could possibly have imagined five or ten years ago. The media doesn't like to admit that because of course the media always wants bad news because they say it sounds better. But from a technological perspective, we are way ahead of the curve.”

…white, and the other thing is behavioral science. And so when you have 196 countries, all of whom have different interests, different concerns, different motivations, to come to agreement by consensus, if it's in the formal negotiating process, is honestly not that easy. We tend to think that it's

…fact is that 10 years ago, we never would have imagined that we would have advanced as much as we have already on renewable energy capacity in the world. We never could have imagined that we would have advanced as much as we have already on electrification of vehicles. We never would have imagined

Elsewhere in the episode, we speak with Sappora Berman, who's the founder of the Fossil Fuel Nonproliferation Treaty Initiative, about the Santa Marta conference, which is named after the city in Colombia where they held their first big international conference in April. And for listeners, it's a…

So I would agree that it is actually a very helpful process to advance some and not all of the purposes of the Paris Agreement, as there are many others. So we have other coalitions on

clean vehicles. We have coalitions on updating and modernizing ports. We have many. Different coalitions, thank heavens. And they are all coalitions of the willing to pursue the ultimate goal of the convention. And I think that was made very clear in Santa Marta, where, you know, some maybe arrived…