The Tech Download · October 2026
The host asks what Europe has to do to be part of the AI conversation alongside the US and China. Hotard, who runs Nokia, holds up Finland's deal for Google to build data centers there as the model. He later says that in technology, if you don't win one cycle you may not be around for the next.
Well, I think it's a moat. I like having lots of moats, but we're excited about our optical components business.
Another interesting point you mentioned just a few moments ago is about Europe. And you said you've been very vocal about the need for Europe to build out its connectivity. There is obviously this large debate and geopolitical race to some extent around who's going to win AI or who's going to be a more dominant player in AI. And often the conversation centers around the US and China. And there is a view that Europe is behind on multiple areas, whether it's semiconductors, whether it's the models themselves, whether it's the ability to build the kind of data centers and the connectivity that the US and China have. What is your view here? Does Europe, what does Europe need to do to kind of be in that conversation?
Well, look, I've been pretty vocal on this on a couple of levels, but let me take an example of doing this right in Europe. And I'm going to pick, I'm probably a little bit biased because we're based in Finland. So I'm going to pick Finland. Finland has a great history of technology companies, not just Nokia, but you've got a quantum company, IQM, there, that just recently went public. You've also got internet gaming companies. If you look kind of across the cycle, Finland's got a great group of technology companies. It really outpunches its weight given its size. So it's really a great player. What Finland has done, which I really applaud the government there, is they've worked out a deal with Google to have Google invest into Finland and invest and build data centers. It's creating jobs. It's underwriting the investment in power generation, modernization, nuclear power plant generation, modernization. It's also creating a bed for innovation. The advantage we have in Finland is that we have great networks. We have some of the world's best 5G networks, the best edge network and routing. We have some great customers in Finland and the telco operators. They're great examples of what is being done right. That's the kind of bed you need to build because the reality, if you think about it, you're an AI developer, you're trying to build an app or a service or maybe even a model. Well, where are you going to go to get that infrastructure? And today that answer is: I don't have anywhere to go in Europe. So I'm a big advocate of these kinds of partnerships. And I think it's great to, you know, sovereignty is obviously essential. The reality, and I've been quite vocal about this, the reality is to be sovereign, you also need to be competitive. And the reality is no one today is sovereign or truly independent. No one has complete independence from the rest of the world. There's no isolation. So sovereignty is about control, innovation, scale, and speed. And that's what we need to see, I think, more broadly in Europe. But I think Finland is doing it right. By the way, I think there's credit is deserved not just in Finland, but Across the Nordics. You see companies out of Sweden, Lovable example, great example as well. This is the kind of approach and investment we need. And obviously, there's some benefits just in terms of where Finland is located. We can leverage the water that's used for cooling, for thermal reuse, for heating. We have some advantages around green power because of our infrastructure. There's some things that Finland has structurally around its grid that are advantageous. But it doesn't mean that everybody has to solve it the way Finland does, but the mindset has to be, for us to be sovereign, we have to be competitive. And I think it's actually a pretty existential issue for Europe because the reality is the internet was largely about media, content, entertainment, consumer digitization. Obviously, there were a lot of value, a lot of commercial value as well. But if you think about those big companies, social media companies, search, Europe missed a lot of that. There's really not, you can't point to a lot of players that were winners in the internet super cycle, right? That didn't happen. But it's more existential because think about the industries that are going to be transformed by physical AI, vehicles, robotics, industrial automation. And I really applaud companies like ASML. I mean, what Christoph is doing, championing, championing this push in Europe. I mean, they're an industrial automation company. They need AI to be competitive because he realizes that what he's building, which is leading edge semiconductor manufacturing equipment, is he's not going to stay on the leading edge if he's not innovating at pace. And so he's leveraging that. My push to Europe is, let's use this as an opportunity to make big investments in digital infrastructure. We don't need necessarily build frontier models. Leverage great work like what Mr. All is doing, what Arthur and team are doing around innovating in open models. It's another great place where Europe can lead, but also drive the sense of urgency around innovation in its core industries because the alternative is it will get done by someone, right? And ultimately, what we miss sometimes in technology is technology is very much about speed and scale. Because what I don't get in technology and Nokia, this is a company that's a living history of it, right? You win one cycle. You're not given the right to necessarily win the next. And you obviously saw that with phones. So in technology, if you don't win the cycle, you may not be there for the next one. And I think that's the urgency that we have. And why we're, you know, I'm really pleased that at least in Finland and to see some signals across the Nordics, that that's well understood. It's also why we're trying to do our part. We're leaning in on the AI Gigafactory effort in Finland and making the leader, making commitments around that, because we want to see a strong and competitive Europe. By the way, competition is good. It's great for the U.S. We'll see more innovation. As an American, I know that competition will drive more innovation in the U.S. as well. And that means ultimately that the Western world will be competitive. And I think that's really important for the future of the Western world.
Yeah, and just to clarify, Justin, when you say it's existential, it's because Europe's industry is built on manufacturing and so much of these traditional industries where if it doesn't modernize with AI, then there is that existential threat, whether it comes from U.S. companies or Chinese companies or elsewhere, that if they're not modernizing with AI, then that's where it's existential. Yeah,
that's right. I mean, you think about it, there's a small number of hyperscalers. They're all basically in China and the U.S. They were born of the internet supercycle. Many of them are investing aggressively in the super cycle. But the next step is where's autonomous vehicles coming from? Today, it's largely the U.S. and China. But who are the automotive leaders? A lot of the automotive leaders are in Europe. And if they don't invest to win, it's not, you know, regulating against it. Of course, I'm all for making sure we have safety and security. These are really important. But you can't slow down the progress of technology. Do
you think European regulation right now is hampering Europe's ability to compete in AI?