“For years at OpenAI, it felt like we knew the biggest secret in the world. Everybody was calling us an idiot. … Looking back, it was like an incredible gift because it meant we didn't have this massive competitors and we had time to do our research and build our stuff and build our company.”

…like where you can build up a valuable business, how to think what about like a good network effect or sort of a good moat looks like versus a fake one. But I would bet that this generally will cut against many years of experience in favor of people who have a lot of fluency with the tools.

…of OpenAI and that it actually started as YC research looking at this idea. I mean, kind of a crazy idea that you and a ragtag crew decided we're going to dedicate our lives to this creation of AGI. But today it sounds fatal complete, right? But that really wasn't how it felt when you started.

It sounds like in your journey, there were like a few different things that stacked. Maybe the first one was even that AGI was possible to be built and finding other people who believed that thing. It didn't matter that lots of people didn't think it was possible. It mattered that you found.…

Yeah, we used to joke that only 50 people in the world believed that AGI was possible, but it was okay because 45 of them worked at OpenAI. And I think that's kind of true. Like, you don't need a ton of people. And in fact, saying the heretical thing was probably why those people wanted to all be…

One of the things that people in the room are probably thinking is like, well, I believe this thing, but I haven't found my people yet. Like, is that delusion? You know, what is that actually maybe even a gate that you would propose people have? It's like, well, you need to find, you know, five…