KW Karen Washington On Food Talk with Dani Nierenberg (by Food Tank)

“I flipped it and called it food apartheid, because I wanted our conversation to be intentional. Be intentional about race and racism. Be intentional about where a person lived geographically, about the wealth that was built on the backs of enslaved and Indigenous people. … Food desert reminded me of just putting a pin on a map and saying, that's where people have limited access to food. We're human beings. … And then I went to people in the desert and I said, y'all got food? Yeah, we grow food in the desert.”

Food Talk with Dani Nierenberg (by Food Tank) · Alternative Proteins · September 2026

Context

Washington, a Bronx farmer and activist, coined 'food apartheid' as a replacement for 'food desert'. Kim Severson had asked what conversation about food education is missing. Washington's objection is that 'desert' describes a place as naturally empty and puts the blame on the people living there, when those communities are already growing food and asking for resources nobody sends.

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Transcript

Food Talk with Dani Nierenberg (by Food Tank) Around 43:34 into the episode

Karen Washington

That was a no. That was a no because. But

Kim Severson

let's unpack why.

Karen Washington

…about the wealth that is built, the wealth that was built on the backs of enslaved and indigenous people. And we weren't having that conversation. And food desert reminded me, you know, of just like putting a pin on a map and saying, oh, so that's where people have limited access to food without, we're human beings. I mean, that's not human when you're saying you live in a food desert. And then I went to people in the desert and I said, y'all got food? Yeah, we grow food in the desert. So again, you know, when it comes to education, let's sort of have that education on how this country was built. Because right now we have an administration that wants to take away our history, want to sanitize our history. It ain't going to happen.

Kim Severson

All right. Well, you have my vote, so that's good. Just talk a little bit about, though, the realities of hunger, though, you know, and, you know, talk about food. I mean, the real thing is there are a lot of people who are hungry and increasingly can't get the calories that they need. You know…

Karen Washington

It's not sustainable. I love my food pantries and soup kitchen because there's a need. Right. And the need was always for emergency purposes. It wasn't a way to feed people. And I see that it's starting to... It's become systemic, yeah. Yeah, you know, instead of giving people the tools to get off…

Kim Severson

So those food pantries become part of an ecosystem to help somebody move up and that they needed to be broadened out than just excellent.

Speaker names come from our own diarization. The position is estimated from where the line sits in the episode.

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