Things Alex Gibney Has Said on Podcasts

“Over time, as he increases more and more power, there is only one character in all his companies, and that's Elon Musk. And only one character in all of his marriages, that's Elon Musk. Everyone else recedes into the background.” — Alex Gibney, Uncanny Valley | WIRED

Gibney responding to host Zoë Schiffer about a moment in the film where Justine Musk disputes Elon's account of their first child's death. Gibney calls it main character syndrome and says it defines Musk.

Uncanny Valley | WIRED · 2026-10-13 Permalink → Listen →

Uncanny Valley | WIRED Around 13:35 into the episode

Alex Gibney

…You know, you say things that are absolutely outrageous. We're, you know, full self-driving is a solved problem, or we're going to be on Mars next year. He says it with such confidence. The, you know, insights into the human being really become valuable in terms of understanding the larger context.

Zoë Schiffer

…of when their first child died by a SIDS-related incident. And Elon Musk Documentary that he was holding the child. The child died in his arms. And Justine says, no, this was one of the most defining moments of my life. He died in my arms. You really just see how Elon has hurt her over the years.

Alex Gibney

That's right. That, I mean, in a way, that the moment that you recall gets me kind of emotionally worked up, even as I think about it, because of course, that moment was deeply painful for Elon. But to sort of credit grab in the midst of a tragedy like that seems so petulant and small. And also, you know, sort of talk about main character syndrome. That is kind of one of the defining things about Elon Musk: over time, as he increases more and more power, there is only one character in all his companies, and that's Elon Musk. And only one character in all of his marriages, that's Elon Musk. Everyone else recedes into the background.

Zoë Schiffer

I don't want to ask you to speculate, but I am curious about your take on this because it's a question that I have had about Elon Musk: does he actually believe what he's saying, or is he knowingly lying?

Alex Gibney

I think it's closer to the former. And I've dealt with a number of characters who are like this. You know, Sam Harris in the film makes a distinction between liars and bullshitters. And liars, of course, have to assiduously keep track of the truth in order to know when and how they're lying.…

Zoë Schiffer

It's so hard to remember when talking about Elon Musk Documentary this goober in an Occupy Mars t-shirt who's thrashing around with a chainsaw, waxing poetic about Mars, he has had this undeniable impact on so many people's lives and livelihoods. And a lot of that impact has been negative. The part…

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“That's why I really like this term confidence man, because it gets the whole issue of a con, but it's also this idea of how do you perpetuate a con, it's with confidence. You say things that are absolutely outrageous. Full self-driving is a solved problem, or we're going to be on Mars next year. He says it with such confidence.” — Alex Gibney, Uncanny Valley | WIRED

Documentary maker Alex Gibney on his Elon Musk film. He says the interview with Musk's first wife, Justine, gave him the key: she was drawn to Musk's enormous confidence, and said she learned about gaslighting from him.

Uncanny Valley | WIRED · 2026-10-13 Permalink → Listen →

Uncanny Valley | WIRED Around 12:32 into the episode

Speaker 3

Exquisite.

Zoë Schiffer

…at the beginning, in particular, about whether you're actually going to get enough access for this to work. I'm curious if there was a particular interview, I would guess, with someone close to him where you knew, like, okay, we're going to be able to do this. I think we're going to have enough.

Alex Gibney

Well, weirdly, it didn't happen until very late. And I would say it was the Justine Musk interview. I mean, the Ashley St. Clair interview is as powerful as it is, and it is powerful, and it gives you a front row seat to the election of 2024. The Justine Musk interview gave me insights into his personality that were very powerful in both understanding him as a person, but also understanding some of what he did thematically. And because I asked her, and this answer is not in the film, but it helped to guide me. What was it that attracted you about him back in college? They met in college in Canada. And she said it was his enormous confidence. And then the other thing she said that's powerful that's in the film is that I learned about gaslighting from Elon Musk. That gaslighting thing, the idea of trying to convince somebody that the truth is other than what it is, and to suggest that you're crazy if you don't go along, is a super important insight into who Elon is. And the confidence, of course, is what allows that to happen. That's why I really like this term confidence man, because it gets the whole issue of a…

Zoë Schiffer

Yeah. Yeah. She was such a powerful interview in the film. I think, you know, there are multiple moments where she cries or is near tears. And she comes across just so genuine. And I think she also seems like someone who doesn't appear to be in it for attention or power or money. Like there's a…

Alex Gibney

Zoë Schiffer

Speaker names from our own diarization · position estimated from where the line sits in the episode

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